January 22, 2018

What does the old actor William H. Macy have to say to "the younger guys" about how they should behave in the era of #MeToo and #TimesUp?

He's fielding the question on the fly after winning the Screen Actors Guild Award for his role in the TV show "Shameless." I like the somewhat scattered quality of the collection of ideas:



"In what we do for a living, we’ve got to be free to speak the unspeakable and try things. So I don’t want it to throw a wet blanket on things, and I don’t feel that it will, because half the business is women and they’re smart and they’re hip. It’s a good time to be a girl. I’m proud of this business, because such things as safety in the workplace, that’s done. We’re not going back. It’s changed. It changed in an instant and it’s not going back. When it comes to equality in pay, it’s inevitable. It’s going to happen and it’s going to happen quickly. My hat’s off to our business.... It’s hard to be a man these days. I think a lot of us feel like we’re under attack and that we need to apologize, and perhaps we do.... We had a meeting. A bunch of guys got together under the auspices of Time’s Up. That’s good for men. Men don’t talk enough. Men don't talk to other men. And we talked. What the hell, a little bit can't hurt you."

The first thought is: Preserve the men's freedom of expression. He starts down that road. Perhaps he's thinking that male vitality must rage on or the work product will go to hell. And who will choose to go into film? How can it work?

But he self-censors and shifts to praising women. They're smart and they're hip.

Then he promotes "the business." He's "proud" of it. And he's even eager to credit it with already having solved its problem, because the culture has changed. We're not going back. Hats off! Yay, business!!

Then he gets back to the question. He must feel some obligation to the questioner, now that he's done the necessary promoting of The Business and genuflected to The Women. But what can he say? It's hard. We feel attacked. We feel that we're asked to apologize. We can talk. Well, we were wrangled into a talk session by Time's Up, so we talked. We can talk. It could happen. A little bit anyway. We can talk a little bit without feeling entirely emasculated.

48 comments:

tcrosse said...

Advice to "the younger guys": Wear your cup at all times.

LordSomber said...

Hark! Member of the Film Actors Guild pontificates on Manly Subjects!

Hagar said...

OK, so what did you want to talk about?

We don't know; we just wanted "our voices to be heard."

Those pussy hats may be a good thing; these women should not go out into the winter cold without their heads covered.

Kate said...

Poor guy. You can see him go "oh, shit" when he hears the question. He gives a game and fair answer.

His most interesting line is not quoted in the transcript. "Girls are ascendant." It makes me think of something Keats would write.

CJ said...

Sow the wind, reap the whirlwind, Hollywood.

Shove this garbage down corporate America's throats - ride the tiger and think the tiger won't bite you because you're the one riding it. Now it's turned on you. Maybe your Puritanical rules weren't such a good idea after all.

PB said...

A great actor. Ever see "The Cooler"? I really don't care what he thinks about politics.

Wince said...

"I like the somewhat scattered quality of the collection of ideas."

I found his answer dialectical: "any systematic reasoning, exposition or argument that juxtaposes opposed or contradictory ideas and usually seeks to resolve their conflict : a method of examining and discussing opposing ideas in order to find the truth".

Nonapod said...

The denizens of Hollywood seem to excel at praising each other and their business. It's why they have so many award shows. They truly believe that they're so much better than everyone else. But the #metoo movement has been especially hard on them since it clearly exposed the rather nasty underbelly of Hollywood in a very clear and unambiguous way.

Dude1394 said...

OH no, they've cut the balls off of even Frank Gallagher.

Wince said...

If SAG wanted to be more female friendly, wouldn't their award look less like the "green army men" that boys used to play with?

And notice, when the SAG Award figurine isn't acting... it shuts the fuck up.

Good advice.

traditionalguy said...

Wow! An Actor acts like he likes being under attack from an ascendant "girls" mob that wants him dead today. Great performance by a versatile man. (NB: he's not gay. He's just nice to people)

rhhardin said...

Some guys are willing to say anything women want to hear, and other guys aren't.

Amadeus 48 said...

One of these days things will all come right.

Unknown said...

I get the impression that actors now come equipped with a standard chaff-and-flare package to deal with incoming missiles like this. "Bogey at 12 o'clock, 10 kilometers altitude, 50 kilometers range, closing at Mach 2, standard warhead, Jink hard right, slow to 400 knots and descend to 2 kilometers, suppress active radar, deploy ECM..."

But, seriously, props to Macy for a good try there.

dreams said...

The pussyfication of American and western civilization continues, that is until Islamic extremism conquers, not really conquers, but rather inevitably accepts our total surrender.

Jupiter said...

"We had a meeting. A bunch of guys got together under the auspices of Time’s Up. That’s good for men. Men don’t talk enough. Men don't talk to other men. And we talked. What the hell, a little bit can't hurt you."

They're excluding women!

Roughcoat said...

What a load.

I like being a man. It isn't hard. I'd much rather be a man than a woman. If I felt differently I wouldn't be much of a man, now would I. Probably I'd be gay. It seems to me it's harder than ever to be a woman. So many seem to think it's all going in their direction. The culture is in a manic phase in this regard. Yet it also seems that so many are angry and unhappy. Triumphalism and anger is a toxic combination. I'm glad I'm a man, I can and have withdrawn from the battlefield. Practicing a variant of the Benedict Options. You go, grlz. Be happy if you can.

Amadeus 48 said...

But what if men, in general, and women, in general, are different? Can we homogenize the two sexes and the unlimited number of genders? Are women too agreeable? Are men too disagreeable? Are men too industrious and women too orderly? And where does courtesy fit in? Talk about a social construct! What about courtesy? Can we compel it? Should we? Why? Should we let individuals define themselves in terms of courtesy?

1. All things whatsoever ye would that men should do to you, do ye even so to them.
2. Life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness.

William said...

Why would anyone be proud of Hollywood? Gender pay differences and sexual exploitation like no other industry on earth. Well, no other legal industry. On balance, the drug cartels are probably worse, although the narco traffickers don't publicly brag about their courage and cobtrubutions to humanity.

n.n said...

Two moral axioms: individual dignity and intrinsic value.

One self-evident observation: men and women are equal in rights and complementary in nature.

So, respect her. Don't abort her unless in self-defense. And a division of labor to mitigate the risk of dodo dynasties.

wendybar said...

These poor little millionaires up there crying that 2018 is living in hell are going to hate the next 7 years. I can't wait until all of their movies bomb..and they lose their millions....then they can cry about living in hell...because that is where they are going. Blaming the Tea Party for their "hell" is such a laugh. I guess they should send in some more money to pay more taxes since they don't understand what the TEA Party stood for. Ignorance is bliss.

Achilles said...

He clearly wants to say things.

And he knows that he can not.

That is how people talk when they are afraid.

The lifeblood of fascism is fear.

Wince said...

Boys Keep Swinging

Heaven loves ya
The clouds part for ya
Nothing stands in your way
When you're a boy
Clothes always fit ya
Life is a pop of the cherry
When you're a boy

When you're a boy
You can wear a uniform
When you're a boy
Other boys check you out
You get a girl
These are your favorite things
When you're a boy
Boys
Boys
Boys keep swinging
Boys always work it out

Uncage the colors
Unfurl the flag
Luck just kissed you hello
When you're a boy
They'll never clone ya
You're always first on the line

When you're a boy
When you're a boy
You can buy a home of your own
When you're a boy
Learn to drive and everything
You'll get your share
When you're a boy

dustbunny said...

Such a Frank Gallagher answer! His character in Shameless is precisely that because he will do and say anything to get people on his side and or to keep them from interfering with his scam. He’s wonderful because he gets away with it but just barely. Very Trumpian.

Big Mike said...

First thing out of my wife’s mouth: men won’t act like gentlemen until women act like ladies. I see that Glenn Reynolds agrees.

Fernandinande said...

"Men don’t talk enough." Because men are bad.

Jed Clampett voice: "Pitiful".


Andrew Sullivan:

"I live in a sexual and romantic world without women, where no patriarchy could definitionally exist, a subculture with hookups and relationships and marriages and every conceivable form of sexual desire that straight men and women experience as well.

And you know what you find? That men behave no differently in sexual matters when there are no women involved at all. In fact, remove women, and you see male sexuality unleashed more fully, as men would naturally express it, if they could get away with it. It’s full of handsiness and groping and objectification and lust and aggression and passion and the ruthless pursuit of yet another conquest. And yes, I mean conquest. That’s what testosterone does.

It’s also full of love, tenderness, compassion, jealousy, respect, dignity, and a need for security and a home. It’s men’s revenge on men. The old joke applies: What does a lesbian bring on a second date? A U-Haul. What does a gay man bring on a second date? What second date?"

n.n said...

men won’t act like gentlemen until women act like ladies

Yes, ladies and gentlemen. Equal in responsibility. Complementary in behavior.

Darrell said...

Girls. Yay!

Henry said...

I had no idea where #TimesUp came from until now.

buwaya said...

The Chinese, and maybe the Indians, will take over this, too.
They will hire a bunch of white actors because they (or some of them) are seen to be attractive, probably a bunch of writers and other "creative" types, but they will be calling the shots because they have the real mass markets.

The themes and aesthetics will change to suit, as will the ideological atmosphere.

bagoh20 said...

Do men ever get to "stand" for their issues?

Do they ever get considered as victims of anything?

Women are automatically, knee jerk, accepted as victims, either specifically, or just in general, and you are an asshole to not instantly accept that and respond appropriately, which is usually to blame and attack a man or all men in general.

This is becuase men and women are different. Sure women are "smart and hip", but they are so very tender and helpless. We are not equal, becuase women don't want to be. They want to be special.


NorthOfTheOneOhOne said...

Big Mike said...
First thing out of my wife’s mouth: men won’t act like gentlemen until women act like ladies. I see that Glenn Reynolds agrees.

Hear, hear!

First thing I thought when I read Peggy Noonan's latest; America Needs More Gentlemen.

Quaestor said...

Macy was very effective in Fargo.

Now we know why.

Bad Lieutenant said...

That is how people talk when they are afraid.


Great Ghu, did you see him with his head down, not daring to look at the interviewer or the camera, wringing his hands? Terrified! An older man with a distinguished and apparently blemishless career, terrified of saying the wrong thing! And you fuckers on the left guffaw when we hearken back to Stalin. This IS Stalin! (esque)

William said...

Off topic, but anti-Hollywood. I saw that Netflix documentary about the Mexican actress who went with Sean Penn to meet with El Chapo. She was outspoken in her criticism of Nieto, the Mexican president and of Trump. Her words about El Chapo, however, were carefully phrased, and she said nothing that El Chapo could take offense at. I believe Sean Penn is similarly circumspect when he talks about El Chapo. I don't really blame them for that, but their endless posturing about courage and speaking truth to power wears you out......The one true thing about Hollywood is that they never speak truth to power. All appearances to the contrary are special effects. Harvey Weinstein used to be a power. The El Chapo of Hollywood........Nowadays the #metoo movement is the power, and no one will speak out against it.

William said...

Rant continues: I recently saw The Battle of the Sexes. It was a movie about the tennis match between Billie Jean King and Bobby Riggs, and it was a crock of shit. Bobbie Riggs was presented as a joyless gambling addict. That just wasn't true. Bobby Riggs knew how to have fun and make money. His sexism was more like that of Andy Kauffman, the wrestler, than like that of, say, Bill Clinton or Harvey Weinstein. His over the top statements were meant to up the gate and not to drive women back to the kitchen. It was meant in fun, and it was taken in fun. There was nothing earnest about it, and Billie Jean picked up the biggest paycheck of her life........The movie depicts a tender and nourishing romantic relationship between Billie Jean and her hairdresser. More horseshit. In reality, Billie Jean's relationship with her live in girl friend crashed and burned. Her lover sued her for palimony. This had the inadvertent effect of outing her and dried up her endorsement money. She needed the money that that sexist Riggs had made for her........In the movie, her husband s presented as something like a cypher and a fifth wheel in her success. More horseshit. Her husband, with whom she's still on friendly terms, was supportive and his business acumen gave her the framework needed to set up a seperate tour for woman's tennis.

walter said...

#womennotgirls
..or did Lena Dunham make that use ok?

dreams said...

Again, we've been a sluts are us country since the sixties.

William said...

Hollywood is a high rant neighborhood. Rant continues. The movie presents Margaret Court as a prissy, disapproving Puritan. It claims that she lost her match to Bobby Riggs because she lacked grit and character. More horseshit. Court, after her tennis career ended, became an evangelical minister. She has spoken out against gay marriage. In her native Australia, there's a move to take her name off of tennis stadiums named after her. You can't say that Margaret Court isn't afraid to speak up. Billie Jean King, by way of contrast, never really spoke up for gay causes until after she was outed by her lover. Advantage Court in terms of taking an unpopular stand......Also, what are the odds that Hollywood will ever present a homosexual couple in an exploitive or manipulative relationship. Gay romances in Hollywood are always idyllic. In real life, Billie Jean had far better luck in her heterosexual rather than gay relationships.

William said...

It's now ok to speak against Harvey and even Mat Damon, but there isn't a single person in Hollywood who would ever dare criticize Jane Fonda, much less Meryl Streep,

Bilwick said...

If I'd been him, appearing on "Maude," I'd have been so hot for Bea Arthur they'd have had to turn the garden hose on me.

Oh, wait. Wrong William Macy. Never mind.


whitney said...

Have they started pillorying him yet

Paul Snively said...

Hmm. I see Willam H. Macy taking a serious question seriously, and answering it in a way that reflects the ambiguity of the moment, a sincere respect for women, an appreciation of the need for honesty in acting, and a question as to whether men discuss their roles in society enough.

If this resembles the characters he tends to play, no, that's not an accident: Macy is very up front about playing flawed Midwestern Lutheran everymen ("I am Lutheran down to my socks," he says, and as far as he's concerned, so are his characters). He takes his faith seriously. My guess is his wife, Felicity Huffman, does, too. And I think he sees his roles as his form of witness: this is what a guy in need of redemption looks like. So when the question is relationships between the sexes, it's informed by his faith, his experience as a husband, his experience in his industry, his experience with his wife, his experience talking with other men... and this is what that sounds like, quickly summed up.

No, it's not a handy sound-bite. I think that's a good thing.

Etienne said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Ambrose said...

I remember when that was the "young" William Macy and the "old" one co-starred on Maude.

Leland said...

I think Macy knew. I'll accept that his knowledge was likely far less than say Affleck's, Clinton's, Streep's, or Winfrey's; but he likely has a bit more knowledge of the casting couch than most of us that freely claim knowledge. He, others, and some of us can claim offense regarding Trump's pussy grabbing remarks. But most of us know that fundamentally, Trump is right about the benefits of celebrity, even amongst other celebrities, and you can bet Macy knows and has also benefitted.

So now he gets the question that he knew he would get and he probably would have been happy to not even be nominated this year just to avoid. Now the nightmare he's played over and over is a real life act that he has to perform. He has to answer THAT question. And so he got up on the tightrope he decided to walk as his act, and fell off like any of us who decided for the first time to jump up on a circus tightrope. It wasn't an Oscar worthy performance to most of us, but for Macy, it is probably good enough for the real thing in Hollywood.

Bob Loblaw said...

"The younger guys" aren't the problem. Even if they want to be the problem, they don't have enough power to be the problem.

Scott X said...

Macy acted in both the theatrical and film version's of David Mamet's "Oleanna." In it, Macy plays a college professor who is in all probability falsely accused of sexual harassment by a female student of his (Mamet is slightly ambiguous about this). I don't see how appearing in "Oleanna" wouldn't at least partially color how Macy perceives the #Metoo movement. Of course, his marriage to the actress, Felicity Huffman would also play a part in how he has reacted to this very public shaming of the men of Hollywood.

It's been over 20 years since I've seen the film, but I remember it to be extremely interesting and thought-provoking. The film seems quite topical right now, so it's probably time for me to seek out this movie again and see if I have remembered it correctly.
Thanks for jogging my memory with post, Ann.